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XIII
新手上路

Guatemala
99 Posts

Posted - 08/10/2008 :  17:00:51  會員資料 Send XIII a Private Message
http://www.russiatoday.ru/news/news/28664

August 9, 2008, 3:30
Time line: Georgia-Ossetia armed conflict, August 8
23:25 GMT - Georgia resumes intensive shelling of Tskhinvali's residential quarters.

22:50 GMT - Heavy shelling reported in Tskhinvali.

22:00 GMT - Georgia resumes intensive fire on residential areas in Tskhinvali, the Peacekeepers' commander says, reports TASS news agency.

21:27 GMT - South Ossetia's military have downed a Georgian attack plane, the Russian Vesti television channel reports. The fall of the blazing plane was videotaped. The fate of the pilot remains unknown.

21:25 GMT - Georgia announces plans to withdraw half of its peacekeeping contingent in Iraq because of the South Ossetian crisis.

21:22 GMT - South Ossetia is fully in control of Tskhinvali, but Georgia is making attempts to retake the city, accordign to the self-proclaimed republic's official spokeswoman Irina Gagloyeva.

20:36 GMT - The UN Security Council has begun closed-door consultations to discuss the situation in South Ossetia. The meeting, initiated by Georgia, is the second in 24 hours.

20:25 GMT - Georgia asks US to put pressure on Russia to "stop the armed aggression" in South Ossetia

19:19 GMT - Twelve Russian peacekeepers killed and 50 injured in South Ossetia, according to Russian Army Assistant Commander Col. Igor Konashenkov.

19:08 GMT - President Dmitry Medvedev says: “Russia is taking adequate military and political measures to put an end to violence in South Ossetia.”

18:56 GMT - The breakaway region’s government says Tskhinvali is fully under South Ossetian control, but fighting over one of the city's districts is continuing.

18:36 GMT - Russian Emergencies Ministry plane has taken off from Moscow region. It will deliver a mobile hospital to North Ossetia to help refugees from the south.

18:31 GMT - South Ossetian armed units deployed near Tskhinvali have started firing at Georgian military positions, according to Georgian media.

17:48 GMT – Georgia admits up to 30 causalities on its side during the offensive.

17:35 GMT – In a televised address, Georgian President Saakashvili claims Georgia ‘controls Tskhinvali and most South Ossetian villages and regions.

17:22 GMT – Hundreds of volunteers enter South Ossetia from Russian territory.

17:20 GMT – South Ossetia calls on the world to ‘stop the genocide’ in the region and recognise its independence.

17:03 GMT – Ossetian leader Kokoity says 1,400 people were killed in Friday's confrontation.

16:55 GMT – Georgia withdraws half of its troops from Iraq.

16:46 GMT – Thousands of people continue to flee the violence in South Ossetia. Most of the refugees are sheltered by their relatives in North Ossetia.

16:32 GMT – Abkhazian troops vow to march on towards the border with Georgia regardless of developments in South Ossetia.

16:14 GMT – Russian Air Force denies bombing a Georgian military base.

15:50 GMT – Russian troops will suppress any fire from Georgian forces aimed at South Ossetia, warns Russia’s Defence Ministry.

15:14 GMT – Russia bans flights to and from Georgia, starting at midnight on Friday.

15:03 GMT – UN Security council to discuss the situation in South Ossetia on Friday night at 19:00 GMT.

14:52 GMT - Shootings cease in Tskhivali as people check damages.

14:35 GMT – Ossetian authorities report more then a thousand dead in Tskhinvali.

14:23 GMT – Mass fires reported in Tskhinvali.

1410 GMT – South Ossetian President Kokoyti announces the breakaway republic’s troops are driving Georgian forces away.

14:05 GMT – Hundreds of civilians have been killed in Tskhinvali, according to South Ossetian President Kokoyti.

14:01 GMT – Georgian Foreign Ministry calls on the world community to make Russia ‘understand, that invading a sovereign state is unacceptable’.

13:43 GMT – President Medvedev orders Prime Minister, Emergencies Minister and Interior Minister to organise humanitarian aid for South Ossetia.

13:25 GMT – Russian Defence Ministry accuses Georgian troops of shooting at peacekeepers and civilians and denying them medical help.

13:21 GMT – Russian Defence Ministry confirms more then 10 Russian peacekeepers have been killed in South Ossetia on Friday and 30 others wounded.

13:16 GMT – Saakashvili accuses Russia of ‘waging a war’ against Georgia, asks for U.S. support.

12:57 GMT – International community must stop turning a blind eye on mass arms purchases by Georgia, says Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov.

12:55 GMT – Russian FM Sergey Lavrov accuses Georgia of ethnical cleansing in Ossetian villages.

12:37 GMT – "If Russia indeed sent its troops to Georgian territory, it means we are at war with Russia," said head of Georgian national security council.

12:34 GMT – Russian envoy to NATO Dmitry Rogozin calls on the alliance’s member states not to support Saakashvili.

12:31 GMT – Georgian Parliament speaker David Bargadze accuses Russia of ‘military aggression’, and threatens to use ‘all means necessary to protect the country’s sovereignty’.

12:22 GMT – Germany’s leader Angela Merkel calls for an immediate end to the use of force.

12:19 GMT – Tskhinvali residents emerge from shelters after a lull in fighting, report Ossetian peacekeepers. The city is short of water and electricity has been cut in many areas. Telephone communications are difficult.

12:13 GMT – Georgia accuses Russia of bombing its military base near Tbilisi.

12:04 GMT – Russia’s Defence Ministry announces it has sent peacekeeping reinforcements to South Ossetia

11:57 GMT – Peacekeepers report South Ossetians destroy several Georgian tanks, re-take Tskhinvali.

11:41 GMT – Russian communists and liberal democrats call for State Duma meeting to discuss the situation in South Ossetia.

11:33 GMT – South Ossetia reports that Russian armoured vehicles have entered Tskhinvali.

11:25 GMT – Tskhinvali ‘completely destroyed’ after massive shelling by Gerogian troops, reports head of peacekeeping force.

11:17 GMT – Georgia gives South Ossetians three hours to surrender.

11:12 GMT – International Red Cross Committee is ‘deeply concerned’ with the humanitarian situation in South Ossetia.

11:02 GMT – PACE will support any effort to resolve the conflict in South Ossetia peacefully.

10:59 GMT – South Ossetia accuses Georgian hackers of attacking its Information Ministry’s website.

10:58 GMT – Russia will not allow the death of its citizens go unpunished, says Russian President Dmitry Medvedev.

10:56 GMT – Wounded people from South Ossetia start arriving to North Ossetian hospitals.

10:45 GMT – Keeping volunteers away from South Ossetia ‘will be difficult’, says Prime Minister Vladimir Putin, who’s visiting China for the opening of the Olympics

10:33 GMT – Georgia announces a three-hour ceasefire starting from 11:00 GMT to let civilians out of the conflict zone.

10:26 GMT – Transdniester may allow volunteers to fight in South Ossetia, says region’s Foreign Ministry.

10:23 GMT – Peacekeepers ask Abkhazia not to send its troops into the demilitarized zone.

09:53 GMT – British Foreign Office calls on the two sides to stop military actions and resume negotiations.

09:36 GMT – Georgia’s aggression gives the Russian Parliament a ‘serious reason’ to recognise South Ossetia’s independence, says chair of Federation Council Sergey Mironov.

09:21 GMT – NATO Secretary General Jaap de Hoop Scheffer calls for an immediate to violence in South Ossetia.

09:05 GMT – Russian Defence Ministry says it won’t let Georgia harm peacekeepers and Russian citizens.

08:32 GMT – The European Commission’s head of foreign policy tells Mikhail Saakashvili to do everything necessary to stop violence in South Ossetia.

08:18 GMT – Firefight spreads to Tskhinvali streets, reports head of peacekeeping force.

07:49 GMT –Emergencies Ministry ready to evacuate Russian citizens from South Ossetia if ordered to.

07:44 GMT – Abkhazian forces move to border with Georgia and concentrate near the demilitarised zone.

07:44 GMT – Mikhail Saakasvili says Russia has launched a full-scale military operation against Georgia.

07:20 GMT – Georgian Minister of Reintegration asks the international community to stop putting pressure on Tbilisi and help find a compromise.

07:02 GMT – Russian Migration Service ready to deal with refugees from South Ossetia.

06:51 GMT – UN Security Council fails to approve a Russia-sponsored ceasefire call.

06:17 GMT – Firefight intensifies at Tskhinvali outskirts, says South Ossetian President Kokoyti.

05:57 GMT – Georgia pledges to pardon South Ossetian leadership and invest $US 35 million into the region

05:28 GMT – North Ossetia prepares for the arrival of more than 2,000 refugees

05:01 GMT – South Ossetia asks Russia for protection and to help it stop the bloodshed

04:13 GMT – Georgian troops resume attack on the South Ossetian capital Tskhinvali.
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慎.中野
我是老鳥

27657 Posts

Posted - 08/10/2008 :  21:01:48  會員資料 Send 慎.中野 a Private Message
http://news.bbc.co.uk/chinese/trad/hi/newsid_7550000/newsid_7552400/7552458.stm
格魯吉亞軍隊撤離南奧塞梯首府

格魯吉亞內政部說,他們的部隊現在已經撤出南奧塞梯首府,並說俄國現已完全控制當地。

-

戰局大勢已定,除非喬治亞準備了反擊計畫。

----
「我乃是根據個人一向仰賴的研究方法而得出結論。我的方法就是:道聽途說加上斷章取義,然後歸納推理,最後忘掉訊息來源,開始強詞奪理,堅持我所言就是既定事實。」
史考特.亞當斯,《呆伯特之黃鼠狼當道》
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慎.中野
我是老鳥

27657 Posts

Posted - 08/10/2008 :  21:16:21  會員資料 Send 慎.中野 a Private Message
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Tskhinvali_battles.png
Movements of opposing forces on 8 August. Blue arrows show Georgian attacks, red show Russian

Wikipedia上的一張戰鬥示意圖,算是一種馬路消息。

我是很不能理解為何喬治亞軍沒先攻下Didi Gupta或Dzari,就直接殺向Tskhinvali。就算沒能守住,把Didi Gupta那座橋炸掉至少可以拖延一點時間。

----
「我乃是根據個人一向仰賴的研究方法而得出結論。我的方法就是:道聽途說加上斷章取義,然後歸納推理,最後忘掉訊息來源,開始強詞奪理,堅持我所言就是既定事實。」
史考特.亞當斯,《呆伯特之黃鼠狼當道》

Edited by - 慎.中野 on 08/10/2008 21:18:34
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XIII
新手上路

Guatemala
99 Posts

Posted - 08/10/2008 :  21:39:44  會員資料 Send XIII a Private Message
这张比较准确
http://upfile.cat898.com/UploadFile/2008-8/200881020947843.jpg

格鲁吉亚军确实太废柴了...从8月7日凌晨3;30开打,还动用火箭炮坦克等重武器。结果到俄罗斯援军晚上进来都没有吃掉不到只有3000人的南奥守军...

92年打阿布哈兹族,占尽优势,结果被阿布哈兹族挨到购买的军火到达,之后就彻底开始溃败。从这个例子偶就佩服那些军火之王的神通广大....

现在格鲁吉亚包括打黑工的在内有好几十万人在俄罗斯打拼
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慎.中野
我是老鳥

27657 Posts

Posted - 08/10/2008 :  21:49:00  會員資料 Send 慎.中野 a Private Message
http://upfile.cat898.com/UploadFile/2008-8/200881020947843.jpg

趕羚羊!這個喬治亞的作戰參謀應該拖去槍斃,這是什麼愚蠢的攻勢計畫?

巷戰哪是這樣打的,會贏才有鬼!竟然沒有全面包圍就直接衝進市中心?

那裡又不是非洲!

俄軍從北邊下來,先繞過城市,包圍兩側。驅逐四週的喬治亞軍之後,才佔領城鎮。簡單直接又有效。相較之下喬治亞的指揮官腦袋不知道裝什麼。

----
「我乃是根據個人一向仰賴的研究方法而得出結論。我的方法就是:道聽途說加上斷章取義,然後歸納推理,最後忘掉訊息來源,開始強詞奪理,堅持我所言就是既定事實。」
史考特.亞當斯,《呆伯特之黃鼠狼當道》

Edited by - 慎.中野 on 08/10/2008 22:01:54
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XIII
新手上路

Guatemala
99 Posts

Posted - 08/10/2008 :  21:57:33  會員資料 Send XIII a Private Message
蓝色代表格军,红色代表南奥民兵。可以发现2个制高点1246和1475一直被南奥民兵坚守着。

火炮标志代表格军得3个BM-21单位。

红色进军路线代表俄罗斯第58军的攻击路线(俄军只有2个营)直接从格军的控制区逆推过来...

Edited by - XIII on 08/10/2008 22:01:09
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Reich
路人甲乙丙

Saint Croix
4918 Posts

Posted - 08/11/2008 :  00:15:19  會員資料  Visit Reich's Homepage  Click to see Reich's MSN Messenger address Send Reich a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by XIII

这张比较准确
http://upfile.cat898.com/UploadFile/2008-8/200881020947843.jpg

格鲁吉亚军确实太废柴了...从8月7日凌晨3;30开打,还动用火箭炮坦克等重武器。结果到俄罗斯援军晚上进来都没有吃掉不到只有3000人的南奥守军...

92年打阿布哈兹族,占尽优势,结果被阿布哈兹族挨到购买的军火到达,之后就彻底开始溃败。从这个例子偶就佩服那些军火之王的神通广大....

现在格鲁吉亚包括打黑工的在内有好几十万人在俄罗斯打拼




那個連結上不去了....

_________________________________
2. SS-Panzerdivision "Das Reich",
Panzergrenadier Kampfgruppe z.b.V.
http://blog.udn.com/zbv2004
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Luke-Skywalker
我是老鳥

Taiwan
26649 Posts

Posted - 08/11/2008 :  00:23:02  會員資料  Visit Luke-Skywalker's Homepage Send Luke-Skywalker a Private Message
俄羅斯會不會越玩越大?
目前立陶宛、拉脫維亞、愛沙尼亞與波蘭
已發表共同宣言表達立場
http://www.president.lt/en/news.full/947

=========================
May the Force be with you

President of IMFS(International Military Fans Society)
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XIII
新手上路

Guatemala
99 Posts

Posted - 08/11/2008 :  01:01:40  會員資料 Send XIII a Private Message
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x234/z0rr0101/Osetiya-karta.jpg

重新补地图
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Luke-Skywalker
我是老鳥

Taiwan
26649 Posts

Posted - 08/11/2008 :  01:29:45  會員資料  Visit Luke-Skywalker's Homepage Send Luke-Skywalker a Private Message
喬治亞部隊已經從南歐希夏境內的所有據點撤出
http://news.yam.com/afp/international/200808/20080811062711.html

外電原文
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20080810/wl_afp/georgiarussiaunrest_080810164151

=========================
May the Force be with you

President of IMFS(International Military Fans Society)
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fox xx
新手上路

54 Posts

Posted - 08/11/2008 :  02:12:57  會員資料 Send fox xx a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Luke-Skywalker

俄羅斯會不會越玩越大?
目前立陶宛、拉脫維亞、愛沙尼亞與波蘭
已發表共同宣言表達立場
http://www.president.lt/en/news.full/947

=========================
May the Force be with you

President of IMFS(International Military Fans Society)

這畢竟不是遊戲 有人現在可不想停 等著重新劃地圖
這就是戰爭
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von_Guo
路人甲乙丙

4430 Posts

Posted - 08/11/2008 :  03:44:04  會員資料 Send von_Guo a Private Message



OLYMPIC SPIRIT: Russian Natalia Paderina and Georgia's Nino Salukvadze stepped down from the dais, stood to one side of gold medallist Wenjun Guo, and hugged and kissed.

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dasha
版主

41579 Posts

Posted - 08/11/2008 :  08:03:14  會員資料 Send dasha a Private Message
立陶宛政府的新聞連結看不到東西......是昨天的吧?
從現在有限的資料來看,有點火鳳的味道,搞不好還是黑暗兵法,誘敵進攻然後一舉破敵......而且喬治亞部隊既然有一部份是在敵人後方,那個搞不好還是敵方的香餌吊你的軍隊......

吉屋出售
台北市基隆路二段套房,近台大及捷運,附近有黃昏市場,生活機能便利.
http://www.hbhousing.com.tw/web/A002/index.asp?module=search&file=Detail&No=Z087382%20%20%20&AID=A002
台北縣板橋市大觀路一二樓公寓,接近國小至大學各級學校及公車總站,離捷運及板橋車站不遠.
詳情請洽0931043559田小姐
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Luke-Skywalker
我是老鳥

Taiwan
26649 Posts

Posted - 08/11/2008 :  12:59:00  會員資料  Visit Luke-Skywalker's Homepage Send Luke-Skywalker a Private Message
關於地名譯名的問題
South Ossetia是應該翻譯為「南歐希夏」?
還是參考中國那邊的譯名為「南奧塞梯」?

=========================
May the Force be with you

President of IMFS(International Military Fans Society)
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星艦戰將
路人甲乙丙

Taiwan
1886 Posts

Posted - 08/11/2008 :  15:28:03  會員資料 Send 星艦戰將 a Private Message
還有喬治亞首都“提弗列司”翻成了“提比列西”....(個人偏好使用前者)

而俄國空軍上次動用Tu-22M是在車臣戰役期間,但機會不多.(主要是城市與山區的地面游擊戰為主)

Welcome to MDC force!

Edited by - 星艦戰將 on 08/11/2008 18:59:10
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Kai
剛剛入門

Taiwan
20 Posts

Posted - 08/11/2008 :  21:21:38  會員資料 Send Kai a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by dasha

立陶宛政府的新聞連結看不到東西......是昨天的吧?
從現在有限的資料來看,有點火鳳的味道,搞不好還是黑暗兵法,誘敵進攻然後一舉破敵......而且喬治亞部隊既然有一部份是在敵人後方,那個搞不好還是敵方的香餌吊你的軍隊......

吉屋出售
台北市基隆路二段套房,近台大及捷運,附近有黃昏市場,生活機能便利.
http://www.hbhousing.com.tw/web/A002/index.asp?module=search&file=Detail&No=Z087382%20%20%20&AID=A002
台北縣板橋市大觀路一二樓公寓,接近國小至大學各級學校及公車總站,離捷運及板橋車站不遠.
詳情請洽0931043559田小姐



那個連結有錯,請點左邊的新聞稿區(Press release)

http://www.president.lt/en/news.full/9475

Joint Declaration of Estonian, Latvian, Lithuanian and Polish Presidents on the situation in Georgia

09.08.2008

We, the leaders of the former captive nations from Eastern Europe and current members of the European Union and NATO– Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania and Poland – are extremely concerned about the actions of the Russian Federation against Georgia.

We strongly condemn the actions by the Russian military forces against the sovereign and independent country of Georgia.

Following the unilateral military actions of the Russian military forces, we will use all means available to us as Presidents to ensure that aggression against a small country in Europe will not be passed over in silence or with meaningless statements equating the victims with the victimizers. To this end we intend to urge our governments to take the following positions in discussions and to raise these concerns in the European Union and the North Atlantic Council:

- Can the current Russian authorities be called adequate strategic partners of the EU;

- Can the family of European democratic countries pursue a mutually beneficial dialogue with a country that uses heavy military armour against an independent country;

- It is pointless to continue a “visa facilitation” program with a country that does not meet even the minimal requirements set by the EU and which uses visa facilitation to issue Russian Federation passports to foreigners and then abuses this EU given privilege to claim intervention rights such as "we are protecting Russian citizens" in South Ossetia.

- The actions of the Russian Federation in Georgia should influence the talks with the Russian Federation, including negotiations on the new Partnership and Cooperation Agreement.

We underline the obvious bankruptcy of Russian “peacekeeping operations” in its immediate neighbourhood. The Russian Federation has overstepped a red-line in keeping the peace and stability in the conflict zone and in protecting Russian citizens outside its own borders.

The EU and NATO must take the initiative and stand-up against the spread of imperialist and revisionist policy in the East of Europe. New international peacekeeping forces should be created as the current setting proved to be ineffective.

We regret that not granting of the NATO’s Membership Action Plan (MAP) to Georgia was seen as a green light for agression in the region.

We believe that the EU and NATO as the key organizations for European and Transatlantic stability and security should play a leading and crucial role in securing freedom, security and prosperity of countries not only in the EU but also in the neighboring European area.

It a litmus-test for the credibility of the EU and NATO to solve the conflict in its immediate neighborhood and to prove for all EU and NATO members, aspirant countries and democratic partners that it is worth being members and partners of these organizations.

This Declaration is open for the accession by the leaders of other democratic countries.

President of the Republic of Estonia Toomas Hendrik Ilves
President of the Republic of Latvia Valdis Zatlers
President of the Republic of Lithuania Valdas Adamkus
President of the Republic of Poland Lech Kaczyński

Press Service of the President
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Kai
剛剛入門

Taiwan
20 Posts

Posted - 08/11/2008 :  21:28:15  會員資料 Send Kai a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Luke-Skywalker

關於地名譯名的問題
South Ossetia是應該翻譯為「南歐希夏」?
還是參考中國那邊的譯名為「南奧塞梯」?

=========================
May the Force be with you

President of IMFS(International Military Fans Society)


Ossetia 英文發音大約是 o-see-'shun, 不過本地語與俄語的發音約近似 oh-'set-yuh, 自己挑一個用囉.
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XIII
新手上路

Guatemala
99 Posts

Posted - 08/11/2008 :  22:01:34  會員資料 Send XIII a Private Message
关于此次被击落的图-22M,最新消息![转自超级大本营]

按照俄军的军事体制,远程航空兵集团军(第37航空军)执行核作战任务时由总参作战总局直接控制、执行常规作战任务时经总参谋部授权由空军总司令部具体指挥,部署在各军区的空防集团军,由总参谋部通过军区进行指挥。

这次战役前指应该是总部设在顿河罗斯托夫的北高加索军区司令部,其参战的第58集团军的军部和下属第19摩步师设在弗拉基高加索。但是58集团军没有指挥空军的军级以上单位的权力,况且驻北高加索军区空军虽然拥有第10混成航空兵师,可是好象他们没有图-22M吧?倒是这次被击落的苏-25是由军区空军所属第1近卫强击航空兵师派出的。

如果说是从卡恰的黑海舰队所属第917独立混成航空兵团派出的飞机,那么是莫斯科的最高统帅部下达的命令?但是无论是克里姆林宫还是总参作战总局还是空军总司令部,总不会脑残到派出远程飞机而不派电子支援飞机参战吧?


刚刚从俄罗斯那边获得的消息(当然,都是托英明神武玉数临风不怒自威的火龙老大的福搞到地 ),这次被搞掉了一架图-22M后,莫斯科的远程航空兵集团军司令部和前线航空兵集团军司令部已经成为欢乐的海洋 现在,那些兔崽子们都眼巴巴地盯着黎明镇的空军总司令部,等着看那里将军们的笑话。

虽然包括《红星报》和《共青团真理报》等媒介都接到了阿尔巴特军区的封口令,但是网络时代的作用依然巨大。署名“近卫空中轻骑兵”的网友在《独立报》的网站上这样评价说:“您瞧吧!看看吧!这就是把俄罗斯空军交给防空兵领导的可悲下场。”

俄军在1998年3月将空军和防空军实现合并,新空军总司令部中原防空军人员占明显优势,总司令和参谋长两位主官均出自原防空军,原空军领导班子中仅克利申中将留任,其余几位副司令全部被迫提前退休。就是新的空军总司令部,也设在了位于莫斯城东北部巴拉什欣区的“黎明”镇的防空军总司令部(防空军中央指挥所)。

进行这样的安排,是因为在前苏联的军事体制中,防空军的地位一向比空军要高,仅次于战略火箭军,也高于陆军和海军。同时由于冷战的结束和苏联的解体,华约的解散和苏军的仓促撤离,使原先配属于东德、波兰、匈牙利和捷克等前线国家的军事基础设施被放弃,第一线战略梯队和配套设施全都留在了境外。原部署于波罗的海三国、白俄罗斯、乌克兰等原苏联加盟共和国的军事设施落入独立后的国家手中,包括当初为前线航空兵和远程航空兵建设的大量现代化依托设施。前苏联时代建立的一整套预警、引导和通信指挥系统被破坏,这使前线航空兵和远程航空兵的作战能力大打折扣。相对于空军部队,防空军的防空歼击航空兵的情况要稍好一些(相对而言),这是因为其大部分设施被修建于俄领土内,另外俄与中亚和白俄罗斯达成协议,允许俄防空部队和太空兵继续使用其境内的设施。

新俄罗斯空军建立后,以削减军事开支为名,撤消了远程航空兵司令部、前线航空兵司令部、军事运输航空兵司令部、预备队和干部培训司令部。解散空军第16集团军司令部的结果是,自苏联时代以来欧洲大陆最强大的前线航空作战集群被人为地消灭了。当时就有俄军事评论家指出,好在远程航空兵和军事运输航空兵司令部被分别改编为最高统帅部第37空军集团军和第61空军集团军司令部,空军第16前线航空兵集团军也在4年后重建(隶属莫斯科防空区管辖,因此莫斯科军区也成为全军唯一拥有空军前线航空兵集团军的军区),否则这样搞下去未来的俄国空军将沦落到成为一支仅能执行战术任务的防空支援型空军了。

但是这样的结果,毕竟造成了不少问题。原空军总司令沙波什尼科夫元帅认为,防空军领导机关长期致力于国土防空和防空歼击航空兵的建设,对于担负战略进攻和前线打击任务的远程航空兵和前线航空兵的专业并不熟悉。虽然合并后的俄罗斯空军不再有前线航空兵和防空歼击航空兵的区分,但是由于装备的不同和作战对象的不同,其任务特性的差异是事实存在的。而这一次的俄格冲突,堂堂俄罗斯空军的图-22M远程作战飞机居然被几乎没有多少实力的格鲁吉亚防空部队所击落,这必然又将在俄军内部引发激烈的争论。

目前俄罗斯空军拥有5个防空集团军和一个前线航空兵集团军,以及直属最高统帅部的一个远程航空兵集团军。究竟是否应该恢复前线航空兵司令部和远程航空兵司令部,还是按照西方的模式建立战术空军司令部和战略空军司令部,这将是俄罗斯空军所面临的最大体制改革问题。
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sscorp
我是菜鳥

456 Posts

Posted - 08/11/2008 :  23:15:19  會員資料 Send sscorp a Private Message
看到一個說法是
那架Tu-22M是執行任務後回航掉到黑海裡的
也就是說也許是機械故障或戰傷, 而不是凌空被打成火球
目前有什麼更新鮮更獲得求證的說法嗎?
另外現在俄軍要求喬治亞部隊繳械了, 那他們也許可以弄到一堆M4跟G36來玩....
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XIII
新手上路

Guatemala
99 Posts

Posted - 08/12/2008 :  01:37:20  會員資料 Send XIII a Private Message
美国人的乌龙事件

Google News也及时进行了报道,但文章匹配的Google Maps地图却搞出了乌龙,上面赫然标记着俄罗斯军队入侵乔治亚州沙瓦纳,第三次世界大战爆发?以至于有位Yahoo Answers用户Jessica B.问“我住在乔治亚州,但没看到俄罗斯人在哪儿出现,甚至也没听到应该会让我害怕的坦克声音”(Google cache)——可惜某个扫兴的家伙把它删除了。

注:格鲁吉亚和乔治亚州的英文名称都是Georgia。

“谁能告诉我为什末会这样!俄国人居然在佐治亚有驻军!我要求政府和国会给我一个解释!我在线等!”
——当年美国务院网站上的经典留言
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星艦戰將
路人甲乙丙

Taiwan
1886 Posts

Posted - 08/12/2008 :  05:49:17  會員資料 Send 星艦戰將 a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by sscorp

看到一個說法是
那架Tu-22M是執行任務後回航掉到黑海裡的
也就是說也許是機械故障或戰傷, 而不是凌空被打成火球
目前有什麼更新鮮更獲得求證的說法嗎?
另外現在俄軍要求喬治亞部隊繳械了, 那他們也許可以弄到一堆M4跟G36來玩....



前蘇聯解體後,經費不足致維護體系無法順利運作,致俄國空軍部份機型的續航能力正持續降低當中.....

過去習慣使用俄製武器的喬治亞,終究要做出不同於其他鄰國與俄國的嘗試.猶如曾習慣用美製武器的委內瑞拉轉而向俄國採購武器的例子一樣.

Welcome to MDC force!

Edited by - 星艦戰將 on 08/12/2008 07:16:22
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dasha
版主

41579 Posts

Posted - 08/12/2008 :  08:03:34  會員資料 Send dasha a Private Message
還有,這些長程轟炸機的電戰能力並不下於許多電戰機,雖然因為高價而通常都會派遣電戰機替這些轟炸機護航,但兩伊戰爭中也是有直接拿Tu-22當電戰攻擊機直接搞垮整個伊朗監偵網後衝進去丟炸彈的戰例,雖然這是二流空軍沒有足夠電戰機才會搞的事情......

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詳情請洽0931043559田小姐
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慎.中野
我是老鳥

27657 Posts

Posted - 08/12/2008 :  09:43:36  會員資料 Send 慎.中野 a Private Message
http://news.bbc.co.uk/chinese/trad/hi/newsid_7550000/newsid_7555100/7555168.stm
格魯吉亞:大部分國土已被俄軍占領


俄軍坦克進入阿布哈茲地區

格魯吉亞總統薩卡什維利周一(11日)對全國發表電視講話說,該國大部分國土已經被俄羅斯軍隊占領。


他說,野蠻的侵略者正在盡全力廢除格魯吉亞的獨立。

稍早,格魯吉亞當局說,俄軍控制了東部的哥里鎮。該鎮距離首都第比利斯約70公里。但是莫斯科對此加以否認。

格魯吉亞軍隊正在撤離哥里鎮,以便加強首都第比利斯的防守。

但是俄羅斯國防部表示,俄軍沒有繼續向第比利斯推進的任何計划。

俄方還表示,俄軍正在從格魯吉亞西部城鎮塞納基撤離,并說已經消除了對南奧塞梯地區的炮擊威脅。

-




從這地圖上來看,佔領史達林的老家哥里,就幾乎等於是把喬治亞切成兩截。

----
「我乃是根據個人一向仰賴的研究方法而得出結論。我的方法就是:道聽途說加上斷章取義,然後歸納推理,最後忘掉訊息來源,開始強詞奪理,堅持我所言就是既定事實。」
史考特.亞當斯,《呆伯特之黃鼠狼當道》
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XIII
新手上路

Guatemala
99 Posts

Posted - 08/12/2008 :  11:55:24  會員資料 Send XIII a Private Message
Gori已经被毛子搞定了

TBILISI, Georgia (CNN) -- The Russian military advanced into Georgia on two fronts Monday, heading toward cities outside the breakaway provinces that have been the centers of fighting.


A Georgian armored personnel carriers burns on the road from Gori to Tbilisi.

1 of 2 more photos » more photos » From the flashpoint South Ossetia, the Russian military moved south toward the central Georgia city of Gori, Georgia said. Russia said its troops were on the outskirts of the city.

A CNN crew in Gori saw Georgian forces piling into trucks and leaving the city at high speed.

CNN saw thousands of troops driving out of the city, as well as thousands of civilians traveling by convoy from Gori toward Tbilisi.

Gori lies along Georgia's main east-west highway, and is an important site for Georgia's communication systems.

Russian troops were also in Senaki, in western Georgia, having advanced from the breakaway area of Abkhazia, Russian and Georgian officials said.
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Luke-Skywalker
我是老鳥

Taiwan
26649 Posts

Posted - 08/12/2008 :  12:20:29  會員資料  Visit Luke-Skywalker's Homepage Send Luke-Skywalker a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Kai
Ossetia 英文發音大約是 o-see-'shun, 不過本地語與俄語的發音約近似 oh-'set-yuh, 自己挑一個用囉.



好像南歐希夏比較接近

=========================
May the Force be with you

President of IMFS(International Military Fans Society)
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